April 14, 2021

Interview With Frank Cain

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The Wolf And The Shepherd sit down virtually with Frank Cain, a bigfoot researcher and master crochet artist. Frank coins a new term for a group of Sasquatch and answers the age old question of who would win in a fight, Chewbacca or Bigfoot. We also discover that one of the Wolf's favorite past times is to knit clothes for his GI Joe collection.

Originally from Iowa, Frank Cain has been captivated by Bigfoot facts, theories, and lore since a young age. His passion for cryptids stems from growing up in an environment where folklore was embraced and exploring the unexplained was encouraged. As and active part of the cryptid community, Frank is known for his enthusiastic searching tactics and fun natured approach to seeking out the unknown and charting a path the truth. 


welcome to this episode of the wolf and

the shepherd today we have with us

frank kane frank good to see you

you too i'm super excited to hang out

with you folks tonight

love it thank you for coming on frank um

i actually tracked you down on instagram

i would like to say like a private

detective but it was more of a stalker

because i was trying to find a

bigfoot expert and uh you were actually

the first person who replied to me i

reached out to a bunch of people they

all replied eventually but you were the

quickest so you won

but your instagram handle on there or

your group is known as

squatch stitcher now i'm sure some of

our audience will actually check you out

after the show

but can you tell them where that name

came from yeah

definitely so obviously i have a passion


sasquatch bigfoot uh and another thing

that i do

uh i go to town on crocheting so i


huge scarves and mittens and hats and do

some knitting

uh and i was like hey you know i need

some type of creative outlet

so i'm going to join both of them uh

like uh just making it happen and

i created an etsy page and sell sold a

lot of my stuff and

it's just been super fun i like to post

things out on social media

uh you know fun little things and memes


a little jokey things about bigfoot and

uh it's just a passion of mine

yeah now don't let anybody ever tell you

that uh crocheting is not a manly


when i grew up in england i actually

lived for about 18 months in a really

small village and we only had two stores

we had

one kind of corner store which was known

as the inconvenience store because they

rarely had anything you wanted like all

the candy was sold out

after school there'd be a mad rush all

the kids would sprint like half a mile

and form a line outside and so you'd be

making your mind up

outside the store what you wanted but

everything started disappearing by the

time you got to the counter like

there's a box of kleenex that's all you

had left to buy but um

the other store we had in the village

was actually a

kind of knitting kind of wall store and

so all the kids kind of naturally just

learned how to knit

so i was making like outfits my gi joe

and stuff and like even so kind of like

hard kids

they had a side business going they were

like making all these gi joe uniforms

that is amazing i mean if i would have

had that skill back in the day i would

have been

unstoppable with my star wars characters

i'm telling you i love it yeah

so can you just give us a little bit

about your background not related

to you know bigfoot just kind of where

you grew up where you live now and

what you do for a regular job and stuff


definitely so um i'm originally from

a little town in iowa uh rural iowa uh


uh is the town and uh you know grew up


and i met my wife uh we we grew up like

a block away

from each other uh went to college

together we we went to uh school for


and then we moved to madison wisconsin


our uh you know

undergrad workers and and so forth and

we just stuck here usually they say that

once you come to madison

and you get the feel and it's got that

that good old vibe

that you don't want to leave and so it

really does have a great feel so

my regular role is i help

in the healthcare space with electronic


record systems and the other thing i do

is i'm a

executive director of an opera company

called fresco opera and that's

kind of that creative piece that i uh

that i miss

right now as the pandemic is doing its

thing so

that's kind of what swayed me into doing

that other passion which is a crocheting

and talking about sasquatch yeah

so talking about sasquatch i mean what


you interested in bigfoot what was that

moment that you said you know what i

bigfoot is my dude yeah so

it's that origin story right it's you

know what made superman superman type of


uh so i would say it was

uh i was a kid and i was watching

this amazing show that was hosted by

leonard nimoy and it was called in

search of and i don't know if you've

ever heard of that that show or not

uh it was like a late 70s type of show

and so i'm sitting there in my living

room watching this thing

uh and i'm just enthralled by it you

know this whole like

big hairy beast type of creature that

could potentially be

real um and it was both exciting

and scary at the same time so i was just


to that tv and at the same time

this is crazy but at the same time my

my mother uh actually

was on the lookout for something that

had been

uh getting in our rabbit hutch

in the back yard so i had a rabbit hutch

i had a bunch

and probably that weekend i recall like

they were completely torn apart the

rabbits were destroyed

um by something that got in there

and basically tore that hutch apart as

well so she was on the hunt for

something that was

taking them out so i'm watching the show

at the same time

i hear a gunshot and i just like hit the

deck in the house

i'm like what the hades is happening um

and my mom comes back in the house with

this shotgun

and she's got uh her lip bleeding

because she has no idea how to use this

gun she just got it up

she's got the butt of it right up

against her her

jaw there uh and

she swear to goodness gracious that

there was some big

big animal beast thing in the back that

she saw rustling

uh in the grove area and she tried to

take it out

uh and that's what kind of inspired my

fascination for this thing i kind of

ended up

taking both this story i was watching on


and this thing that was happening in my

own family's life

and married the the two um and

that later that week it was funny


i said to myself you know what i need to

go find this beast i need to figure out

what's happening

uh i ended up recruiting the neighbor


uh the the gatch kids they were that was

the last name

and they had like eight or ten kids and

we created some posse

and we took my dog the dog's name was

polyester we took

my dog polyester on the hunt and we went

in search of bigfoot so that was the

whole like

you know combination and

thing that got me uh propelled into

loving this cryptid so there you go

right now um i have to ask this question

off the bat really but

do you actually believe bigfoot exists

and if you do

what kind of convinced you because i

know there are a lot of researchers

in different topics who don't

necessarily believe what it is they're

researching and sometimes that

is a good balance to the other

researchers who do firmly believe you

know you get that

confirmation bias and cognitive


you know difference between the type of

investigators so do you actually believe

in bigfoot

i do i do believe and the reason why i


is just there's too many experiences

that people have

reported uh too many too many instances

where there's

very credible credible witnesses like

police officers

and you know people that are in the the

military uh

you know there have been uh other folks


uh just by them telling their

story uh impacts their

credibility overall as a person in


and why would they

take that risk to be open

and fort right with this experience that

they had this

uh this interaction that took place i


that's one reason and the other thing is

there's so many things out in the world

that we have no idea that exists

that we're constantly finding new

species uh

all the time whether it's a different

type of uh

an an ape a smaller ape or insects

or different lizards there's all of

these things

that we just don't know about i think

even you know

in my lifetime uh we had

uh large like grids

that that they thought exist that ended

up washing up on the shore and finally

they say yup there there's these

humongous squids that that exists

out there so yeah that's why i think

bigfoot exists

we haven't found everything we haven't

discovered everything that's out there

yeah and i think there's a world of

difference between

if you prove something like bigfoot


as opposed to ufos because if

you know they find bigfoot it's like

okay well there's another species which

has been hidden among these you know

millions of acres of forest and you know

remained undetected but

with you know stuff like ufos that

goes into a whole different realm of

people with faith

you know challenging their view of the

universe and creationism and all their

stuff and

that changes life a lot if they kind of

prove or release proof that

aliens exist i don't think if they

turned around tomorrow and said we prove

that bigfoot existed too many people's

lives are going to be changed by it

you know yep i totally agree i think


uh there's there's that whole like

uh you know different connections you


you see where uh the mountain

the mountain gorilla as an example i

don't think that thing was really

honestly discovered till maybe the early


and it it ended up being something that

uh we accepted you know but i like you


i think if it was like aliens or whatnot

uh it would be maybe a harder pill to

swallow like oh my gosh

we're not the only things out there in

the universe you know maybe shake that

faith and so forth

uh but i think it it is something that

uh is out there it's not even a needle

in a haystack

i mean i've been in the pacific

northwest i've i've done some

cool things and hiking in that area and

i tell you it's it's a needle

in you know uh millions of haystacks

to be able to find something like that

so totally

yeah i mean i totally get that as well

it kind of reminds me the whole db

cooper thing where he jumps out of the

plane and

you know they found a little bit of the

trace of money but nothing else out of

him and it's right in that same area

that pacific northwest

so uh going on with

the whole bigfoot and you know you

getting interested in it

obviously your friends and your family

they know that you're big into this if


crocheting stuff and you're doing all

this research so what do they think

about you

you know that interest that you have in

bigfoot what's what's their opinion of


uh there's a lot of laughing that takes


uh there's there's a lot of uh you know

like hey frank what are you gonna do

next and i

i think i kind of ag it on a little bit

i i have fun with it uh even though i am

a true believer i also you know like to

be lighthearted

and i think that helps out a little bit

i think if i was super serious and

scientific about it and

you know getting out the the magnifying

glass and saying

you know i'm going on a blues clues

adventure i think they'd probably

kind of uh you know toss me out but

uh honestly i think my family is

accepting of

uh the fun hardness that i have uh for

this cryptid and uh you know i've

actually joked my wife before

uh before we actually did a bunch of

trips uh to the pacific northwest

you know she would say are you kidding

me like you believe in this thing this

is and i said hey

if you can't believe that it's done i

think we need to

divorce i i don't think i can be married

to a non-believer this is ridiculous you

know and

so we joke about it now that we've been

out there a few times

um i've kind of influenced her she's


i can see this you know things can get

lost pretty darn quick out here you know

so they accept it and it's fun it really


yeah now why would you say that perhaps

definitive evidence of bigfoot hasn't


found or if it has i mean

who really are we trying to convince

because i mean there's no reason for


to suppress necessarily the evidence

like you could say with ufos i mean if

there was enough evidence that

you know another species you know a

bipedal great

ape existed out there you know i mean

exactly what evidence do we need to find

because there is footage some of it is

bad some of it's not

obviously there's plenty of proof of you

know footprints and all those stuff but

you know what do you think would

constitute being definitive evidence

that literally

if you had two minutes on a news on a

news show and said look this is the

evidence that bigfoot exists

what could you show yeah

uh we would need we would need a body

i think that's where it'd come down to

whether it's alive or not alive i think


need a body um and the reason why i

don't think that we've

we've found it uh thus far is i just

don't think

we've tried hard enough honestly you

know it's it's

guys like me that are out in

millions of acres of forest and

one guy is going to be able to go ahead

and make the discovery i don't think so

or there's a group of people that think

that they can conquer it

that's why i don't think that's been

found yet

is you know these things are

smart uh and they know how to hide

and you know they they are a little bit

smarter than us when it comes to

uh you know nature right i mean we're so

far removed from that

you think some of us guys that you know

get out there trekking around that that

smell like humans that

that sound and uh

you know sound differently than any

other forest animal like

they're they're gonna know how to hide

right uh yeah so i

i think that's kind of where it comes

down to it is uh they're just better at

hiding than us

you know they're the world champions the

hide and go seek right

uh so that that's what i think it is is

is we're gonna need a body for sure yeah

that's always kind of been my view

that you know there are so many millions

of acres

of forest in the united states i mean i


problems sometimes finding my phone in

the house and i've got an eye watch and

i can do that find my phone thing and it

still takes me

like five minutes to find where i left

my phone so you know trying to find


you know somewhere in like redwood or

something you know it's impossible i

mean even if you're

even if you were talking about there

were 500 of them

and they've got a relatively decent

level of intelligence you're not finding

those things

i mean you'd need the entire national

guard out there

going inch by inch you know in a line

to even stand a chance you know so right

i definitely followed that thing that

yeah if they're half decently smart

they're gonna hide i mean we still

somehow managed to find 30 new frog

species a year

you know in the ecuadorian rainforest

you know without a doubt

right yeah so so frank you know there's

been a lot of expeditions that have

tried to go out and find bigfoot there's


you know some tv shows about finding

bigfoot in fact i think there was even

one called finding bigfoot or something

like that

and so they always put together these

teams and i know there's probably some

solo efforts as well

but if you were gonna captain one of

those teams

how would you assemble your team and

what would you do differently than some

of these other teams have

done that maybe would bring you some


yeah i think that you have to take a

scientific approach i

i don't think that they're doing that

completely they have one scientist

in the entire group uh and then the rest

of it is like

enthusiasts and you know maybe some

folks that

do have some survival skills um you know


i would end up saying that your core

group is going to be your scientists

and the other individuals that are kind


outlying of that core group are folks

that do know

uh you know the wilderness and how to

stay safe and

uh you know what to look for in terms of


you you uh you know may want to go ahead

and traverse

the the land like this or so forth but


a core group of scientists i think is

where it's at so that way

they can use uh technology

and a scientific approach to the whole

discovery of the species that that's

i think that's that's what's what's

missing from this thing and on top of it

this group is going to need cash you

know it's not going to be your weekend

warriors that go out

and find this thing it's not going to

happen it's not going to be doug and bob

come across it while you know drinking a

bud light

you know so i mean that's that's the

thing we

we have to get scientific about it and

we got to get serious about it

and it's not going to happen with one of

these tv shows uh

that's just built for ratings you know

i think that would actually make a good

commercial though if like um

you've got two redneck hunters there

drinking bud light

and bigfoot comes over and snatches out

their hands and says this tastes like

piss and throws it to the ground and

runs off in the woods

yeah that would be a great show i love

it yeah

yeah now i did want to ask are you

interested in any other

kind of cryptozoology stuff i mean where

i grew up in england the only

the only kind of remotely interesting

thing we had was the loch ness monster

up there in scotland

which seemed a bit of a stretch but then

later on when i saw

you know satellite photos of like 60

foot long anacondas

you know in the amazon it was like well

yeah this just could just be a

freshwater sea snake which hasn't been

discovered or whatever

and so it wasn't really a big thing but

i mean there are any other topics in

cryptozoology which kind of interests

you which kind of bleed over

yeah i i'm interested in all of it i you

know i watched

a lot of uh you know documentaries

uh about different creatures and you

know some of those

uh amazing shows on the discovery

channel and so forth

uh you know like the loch ness monster

is a huge one my that's that's my wife's


is the lactose monster um i

i'm fascinated by uh chupacabra

uh i am fascinated mexican

that's right that's right yeah exactly

right yeah uh the

dirt the jersey devil is another one out

there mothman

yeah yeah a couple of documentaries on


yeah so all of those are super

fascinating i think there's the actual


of the entire united united states and

each state

actually has uh encrypted that's

associated to it i think on my instagram

i posted a map of all the different


uh in wisconsin it's the

it's like a beast it's uh um

i think it's and i'm gonna mess this up

and everybody from wisconsin is gonna

you know shake

their fist at me um i think it's like

the braywood or

word uh beast uh and it's basically i

think it's

like a werewolf style type of creature


but yeah i'm interested in all of it i

said that my wife has said well when

things kind of

you know uh calm down a little bit and

we can take some pretty amazing trips i

said i'm hitting it all i'm going on all

the adventures so

and i said the first one is uh we're

gonna hit the the

one in wisconsin the beast to check it

out so yeah

it's super fun i'm glad to hear you


pronounce wisconsin in the correct way

like wisconsin because i actually have a


um avishla and their breed mostly comes

from wisconsin

and she actually barks and when

wisconsin acts and she's like bam


that's awesome love it love it so

have you ever heard the theory that

bigfoot is a

shape shifter i have yep right so what

do you think about that theory

that that's a great question i believe

it comes from

uh the original type of stories from

the native american tribes that talk

about this

uh wild man or uh hairy hairy man that's

uh you know can kind of

uh straddle both the spiritual

as well as uh physical so and i've heard

that and i totally

respect and understand their their

belief in that

um my personal opinion i i think it's

just a physical creature i

i don't think that there's anything that

it can go ahead and hit different

dimensions i also don't believe that you

know there's some type of connection


bigfoot and aliens i don't know if

you've ever seen a lot of those graphics

on t-shirts where

it's got bigfoot being you know like


up by the aliens or you have an alien

wearing a bigfoot outfit

i don't think that any of those things

actually are real and again i totally

respect everybody's opinion but

in my own opinion is i think it's a

physical creature

and i just don't buy the whole popping

in and out of dimensions

now do you think that bigfoot is

restricted to a few

perhaps geographical areas in north

america or do you think it's worldwide

because i think in the himalayas

where i think the yeti was what they

originally called it there

yeah um you know there were multiple

signs do you think this is

something which is all over the kind of

northern hemisphere

across the world about uh yetis and um i

think there's the

what is it florida that calls it the


you know uh there's um like the wood

ape is another and i think that's maybe


maybe that calls it the wood ape so yeah

i i do believe that

there's uh that is all connected and

uh truly i believe

it's one creature that maybe has evolved

depending on its climate

uh there's this uh ape that they believe

it might be

which is called the giant giant and


uh and

my bad and i believe those creatures

stem from one creature that they


that uh extinct because they that it

did not evolve to uh the proper type of

diet to be able to uh you know keep

going i think it was

uh sustaining itself on like fruit and

whatnot and they don't believe that it


into a different type of diet but i

think it has i that's where i think

their origin of this thing came from and

i think each one of those

areas where it's been cited is just an

evolution of that creature

yeah now i don't think

bigfoot's been given exactly the most


series of names from like bigfoot the

vulnerable snowman

the yeti in sasquatch now i've got a

little bit of an admission to make here

somebody told me that sasquatch was a

literal native american translation for


ass and uh i should i should have known

better because i was like told this at

age 37 and i had access to the internet

and uh i didn't bother fact-checking it

and so for a couple of years

i actually genuinely thought it's like

oh they the native americans they see

this ape and they call it fat ass

because i thought

well that goes along with bigfoot i mean

if we're going to be throwing out

insults so i guess fat ass isn't the

worst thing you could come up with but

right yeah

no that's probably totally true there

and you know going along that

so you got big foot right

what do you call more than one big foot

like is it big feet

is it big foots let's do this right now


let's set the record straight we're

gonna we're gonna end up coining this

phrase right here we're gonna

since since we're talking about

sasquatch two right

let's go with like sasquat let's rock

with that

i think sasquatch is a good one for a

plural for it

um or or you know if you go with big

bigfoot what's a plural for bigfoot

let's go with biggies

let's go with that and honestly i've

actually done my research on this as

well on like

what is a plural for it is you know just

like for instance that the geese there's

a whole like uh

what is the the term for the plurals of

the gander or something

uh you know so i there is nothing that

that's out there that i've read

where it talks about you know what a

group of them would be

so i've i'm saying let's go with


well this is your chance mike because we

have enough listeners if you say it


on this show it's pretty much your

domain after that you own it

after it's been on here i love it

that's great now um now going back to


the merchandise stuff you do on xc you

know the crocheting and stuff and

you know i love looking at your memes on

instagram i mean

they're hilarious you know the big theme


do you get many people kind of like

buying that stuff you do on etsy i mean

and is it just from like north america

or do you get people from all over the


yeah i get mostly people from

the us and i think i only have like five

items out there right now i've sold

a ton of stuff uh and each one of my

each one of my things that i sell i

actually name it so

if i end up crocheting a like

emerald green type of uh or sage green

scarf and then put a sasquatch uh

like patch on it i'll create an entire

story that goes along with it so

i'll make mention of that you know


you've been tracking this great beast

for the past five days

and you put down your pack and you know

adjust your

uh your sage green scarf

and across the metal metal you see the

great ape

you know and uh you know the

the hunt is over you've won type of

thing i mean i do a bunch of different


based on like the color of each one of

my scarves so

if i do something that's uh like a

golden yellow

i'll talk about like uh the

the season of of uh the trees changing

and whatnot and

and again you're hunting through the

forest or you're camping out and you

hear some rustling in the woods so

uh i i love to do it i i think it's

it's a combination of both you know

stitching something together with my

hands as well as stitching together a


uh and that that's super fun for me

yeah so you know we talked before about

you're gonna have to have some physical

evidence you're gonna have to have a


right and so let's say there's a

legitimate spotting out there

you know there's gonna basically be two

kinds of groups that are gonna go out

there there's gonna be the hunters

and they're gonna go out there to shoot

to kill and bag it just like they would

a deer or an elk or something like that

but let's say the scientific community

went out there and used one of those

little like tranquilizer dart guns or


and they captured him and him or her you

know let's not assume

the bigfoot gender right um you know him

her they something like that right

so yeah so now we've snugged snag does

it snag snug

whatever it is we we got us a bigfoot


so do you think after that and they do

their scientific studies and all that do

you think

that bigfoot would end up in a zoo


that that right there i don't know i

for the sake of the species i would hope

that it wouldn't

end up in a zoo i think that

there's going to be a lot of folks that

end up going down that route

um and for this again for the sake of

the species

you know sometimes i wonder do we even

want to find this thing is it is it

more about the search and more about the

hunt and more about this

like potential of this beast rather than

fight finding this this species and end


doing exactly the same thing that we've

done with every

other animal that we've ever encountered

you know i i think for the sake of the


of this animal maybe we shouldn't find

it you know i hate to say that

because god it would be one of the most

amazing discoveries uh

you know in history but um i i don't

want to see

things happen to it like the tasmanian

tiger right i wouldn't want to

uh see it go extinct extinct because of

you know humanity yeah and i think

that's the problem because

you know every hunter is going to go out

there trying to snag themselves a big


and get themselves a bigfoot pelt

and stuff and so you know it's one of

those things i hope

bigfoot is real but i hope it's almost

never proved that it's real because i

think it would be

bad for the bigfoot and the benefit to

humankind is very minimal

proving it exists because like i said

it's not that huge of a leap of faith

that there's some big

you know eight out there who's a little

bit smarter

a little bit more evolved than a lot of

apes and you know hides out i mean i

hope it just continues that way in the

fascination with bigfoot is just

that because it would be i think it'd be

a terrible thing you know a bit suddenly

put in zoos and hunters go out there

trying to snag it because

you know i think you get some hunters

going out there for a weekend they don't

find it they give up

but once you provide definitive proof it


they're going to be spending two weeks

or a month trying to find it and hunt it


you know so i hope they kind of never do

produce definitive proofs that

you know bigfoot's out there yeah

i i kind of go i kind of agree with that


so i do have a couple of uh trivia

questions here frank

and i didn't look up the answers so you

can actually uh

bs your way through this so okay here we


the word sasquatch where does it come

from and what does it mean

and not fat like somebody told me

uh all right so

from what i recall uh

it comes from a

native american tribe in canada and i

think the tribe is called the

st aylas tribe if i'm if i'm correct

uh it also pronounced chahelis

and back in like the 1930s

there was an individual that was what

they called an

indian agent uh which was given access

to a tribe and

communicated with them

they were give government the canadian

to interact and

with the affairs of the the native

american tribes

and so he ended up uh

this individual

with this native american tribe and

that's where it came

into play they called the

the uh um the ape

the the ape human they called it


i believe it's s-a-s-q-u-e-t

i believe and uh burns ended up then

calling it sasquatch because of course

you know trying to pick up exactly

what was being said and ended up you


making it into something that you know

he thought it it sounded like sasquatch


that is where i believe the origin of

the name

came from that's a nice story frank but

i still think it means fat ass and

navajo or something

now second trivia question

when was the first recorded sighting of


oh here we go um first modern recording

of of bigfoot

couple different ones one of those

things is a famous

book that was written by teddy roosevelt

i believe in like 18 i'm gonna get it


i think it's like 1864. i think it was

called the wilderness hunter

uh he ended up writing about uh an


that a mountain man ended up having with

uh with this great huge ape

and it ended up taking out the uh

trapping camp that this mountain man was

at and

the encounter ended with his colleague

actually getting his neck snapped by

this creature

uh between the idea idaho and

montana border so that is one of the

earliest encounter

like documented uh encounters that we

know of

another one that i would say that i know

about was

uh in 1924 there was a group

of uh prospectors miners

in the uh in the like mount st

helens area that that came across

a bunch of uh bigfoot so

a sasquatch a big uh of sasquatch

and they uh they threw boulders down

at these prospectors and uh

prospectors apparently said that they

shot one that fell

off of the the uh cliff uh

and then later that night

the uh apes came and started ransacking

uh their cabin and throwing boulders

and slamming their bodies up against the


uh and then they ended up bringing back

rangers to the area to discover what was

going on

of course you know none of this can be

proven uh but those are a couple

of the earliest uh recorded uh instances

or encounters of uh sasquatch

yeah now i was kind of wondering what

theodore roosevelt was doing because

wasn't either one what was his wife's

name eleanor

whether because she was actually um i

think the one who was like supposed to

be pretty much

running the whole presidency because

theodore was

he had his mind on other things so maybe

that was it he was like

trying to find out about bigfoot and he

left he's trying to kind of like make

all the decisions about running the

white house and stuff

i was i was pretty floored at that you


if you have a chance everybody check out


number of number of animals that teddy

roosevelt had it's insane

like that that guy had just an insane

like a a zoo of animals it was crazy

so yeah well the thing is if you did

have a big fur

it would have probably bitten less

people than joe biden's dog at the



that's crazy love it so

i noticed frank you've got a shirt on

with uh wookie chewbacca on there there

you go

and just wondering if you had heard


the filming of return of the jedi back

in 1982 when what

the folks had to do with peter mayhew

in the chewbacca wookie costume

i am a huge star wars fan

i don't know if you can let me see i'm

gonna pan over this direction

you see that i have an x-wing fighter

rocking that right there

yep exactly so yes i

bought this shirt specific for

that story right there um it's got


um and he is definitely in

that typical sasquatch pose you know

that bigfoot pose that we all know from


1967 patterson gimlin uh

footage uh but yeah i heard about that

they're like hey

you may not want to go too far without

some type of vest on because

you're gonna get taken out by some type

of hunter so

yeah for real i that that's insane

though i've

actually been in that location where

that was filmed

and that that is no joke i'm telling you

right now

um that you uh

you don't want to end up looking like a

bigfoot out there for

sure absolutely and so going along with

that star wars kind of theme and

uh i've seen the movie once or twice and

so has the wolf

uh nah we're obviously kidding we're

huge star wars fans too

so in a fight who wins chewbacca

or bigfoot

i gotta tell you

you know okay does chewbacca have a

blaster's hand

or is this this no this is hand-to-hand

combat no

no weapons whatsoever yeah

you know i would say that i'm gonna have

to go with

bigfoot i really am going to have to


i tell you what uh you know

chewbacca yes has some some smarts and


but just the the fierce ferocious

like uh things that i've heard about

what bigfoot can do

i guarantee that thing would probably

rip uh

rip chewbacca apart from them i'm just

gonna throw it out there so

uh sasquatch bigfoot wins all right

now hang on here a little bit yeah but

but this one see

we should have actually asked that

question at the very beginning

because if you're gonna side with

bigfoot over chicago we could have just

yeah we could have just ended the

podcast right there and said

we picked the wrong bigfoot expert here

i know

i totally i get it i get it i i was

trying to be like okay like

scientific like what would seriously

happen seriously though i'm

like chewbacca i'm telling you right now

that's oh hold on you know i have i have

a huge

where's my chewbacca here we go right up


i'm a huge fan there's nothing stopping

me so

love it i'll i'll go ahead and say agree

it's chewbacca

my my i i've changed my mind chewbacca

would do some type of kung fu moves

something uh you know

i guarantee there's some wookie type of

combat fighting stuff that

monkey styles yeah yeah well i've

actually got a fact

which might press both of you in um 2004

there was an expanded um star wars

universe comic book come out

called into the great unknown and it

actually has the millennium

falcon crashing in north america

and han solo dies in the crash and

chewbacca survives

and he becomes the origin of the legend

of bigfoot

oh my god that's amazing

that's amazing we're into the great

unknown yeah okay i i will definitely do


i look that up purposely piss over both

of your parades and come out like

knowing more than anybody but yeah

that's awesome so great

now um one question i did want to ask

we had a little bit of a chat with you

about a week ago and you spoke about

something called a knock-in stick

now the shepherd and i thought a

knocking stick was something which a

pimp has

um but apparently it's got some use in


bigfoot hunting and stuff can you

explain what a knocking stick is

you bet so uh it is believed that

uh sasquatch the sasquatch i'm gonna go

with that sasquatch communicate with

each other

by knocking uh wood together

or knocking against trees and

so for us non-bigfoot folk

we end up using a like a knocking

stick to be able to bang against trees

and see if they will communicate back

and it's something that i've been known

to do

if you check me out on instagram if you

check me out on tic tac

uh there's videos of me

knocking up against doing a what as a

big foot call

so i guess that's just a way for them to

communicate with each other

well i don't know i don't know if it's


uh used in any other type of ape species

i have not yet dived into that

but there might be that might be part of

the origin piece

well i've actually read among certain

species of primates that

they will actually communicate by making

sounds with sticks on trees

and depending upon the tribe of apes or


that however many times they knocked all

the gaps between the knock

it kind of warns them of predators of

this stuff so i mean it's obviously not

far-fetched i mean it yeah

if anything you know you think about how

tribes communicate throughout smoke

signals or

you know versions of morse code i mean

it should be pretty obvious that yeah

maybe that is what they

used to communicate i mean over distance

you know oh yeah

oh yeah because you know you hit the

right type of tree and that thing echoes

uh you know for days and you know i i


envisioned this thing where you have you

know one knocker

uh you know being able to relay one

communication to one and then just down

the line it's almost

very much like you know i think about

the the great wall of china where they'd

have like

certain spots you know set up so that

way they could

you know put some type of signal in the

air to

warn the next one down and the next one

down so

i totally think that it's plausible well

if apple would make one i'd probably get

one because i have sprint and my service


so a lot of times i would think i'd

probably be better off just smacking a


against a tree to get a hold of my kids

when they won't answer their phone

and they always blame it on sprint which

is now t-mobile so

one of these days i'm going to shop

around and maybe give me some better


so so before we kind of close out frank

uh i wanted you to fill us in on your

visit to the

bigfoot museum yeah yeah

that was a few years ago uh i made the

like 2500

uh mile trek

to uh california to willow creek

california to be able to go to the big

foot museum i was super pumped about it


and it ended very much

like uh it ended for the griswold family

that went uh on their great adventure

to uh the amusement park

yup wally world uh i got there

and it was completely shut down it was

one of the days that they shut the

museum down and said sorry

we're not open on thursdays or whatever

the day was i think it was either a

thursday or tuesday that they were shut


and i was devastated um and anybody that

knows me knows that i am relentless

i will make things turn

a water line and that's what i did is i

started making some connections i i went


one restaurant to one convenience store

and i said hey who knows a person that

runs that museum over there

and i finally got a hold of somebody at

a gift shop that says well i have her

name and phone number i said great can i

go ahead and grab that from you i want

to give them a call

and i gave them a call and i said hey i

traveled 2500 miles to be able to come

see you this is my my dream this is my


um i need you to help me out and she


all right it's my day off but i'll go

ahead and come in for you

so that was awesome uh you know such an


woman to be able to open that up for me

and it was funny because there was at


five five or six other people that were

standing there devastated thinking i

made it all the way up here and i didn't

get in the museum

and we she opened it up there was

applause it was awesome so

that was my little story about going to

the will creek

bigfoot museum well that's fantastic man

now um

before we kind of wrap up bigfoot

he's appeared in like i think 10

bugs bunny cartoons and he's a bit

touchy feely

and he keeps referring to bugs bunny as


so do you think it's next in line for

cancel culture

you know after pepe le pew kind of went

out for being a little bit rapey do you


you know the vulnerable snowman's gonna

be the next victim on the warner

brothers list or what

i don't i don't think so um you know

and yeah maybe there there is some of

that like disclaimer stuff that's going

to happen in front of those

those pieces but um

i i think that the uh you know

it just it's one of those things where

uh the bigfoot the bigfoot uh story

uh is is across all cultures right you

know it's this

hairy ape it's this this wild man every

single culture has

its version of this thing um but yeah

you might see a disclaimer on it but i

don't think it's going anywhere

right now frank can you let

everybody know all our listeners know

how they can get in touch with you

your social media in terms of instagram

the etsy store

your email address and we will obviously

post all those

links you know on our website on our


on our youtube and everything else but

you know just let the

listeners know you know they've got any

questions how they can get in touch with


how they can buy some of your

merchandise on etsy and just let them

know how they can get in touch with them

yeah uh best thing is to just go on

instagram check me out on a squatch


that's my handle out there dm me with

any questions

i also have a link to my etsy page which

is a squatch

stitcher page in the in the bio

of instagram i'm also on facebook as

squatch stitcher

you can hit me up on all those channels

and then also i'm

squatch stitcher on tick tock so i have

a few fun videos i

i like to share little things i think

the last video i did was

me and my wiener dog out for some type


urban uh squatch uh sasquatch adventure


uh hit me up on all those channels i'd

love to hear from you

yeah great thank you or frank sorry

great i was trying to say thanks frank

and great frank all at the same time and

kind of got a lot of tongue tied there


well thanks frank for tuning in with us


and spending some time talking about

bigfoot and we hope everybody will go

and check you out on there and that's

going to do it for this episode of the

wolf and the shepherd thanks for

listening and we'll catch you on the

next one


Frank CainProfile Photo

Frank Cain

Bigfoot Researcher

Originally from Iowa, Frank Cain has been captivated by Bigfoot facts, theories, and lore since a young age. His passion for cryptids stems from growing up in an environment where folklore was embraced and exploring the unexplained was encouraged. As and active part of the cryptid community, Frank is known for his enthusiastic searching tactics and fun natured approach to seeking out the unknown and charting a path the truth.